My husband is a MD. I hope you don’t completely depart the two and just “stick to sexuality” as some silly reader said, for that is one reason I read about sexuality on this blog as opposed to secular ones. Have you not just now called to me, ‘My father, you are the friend of my youth— will he be angry forever, will he be indignant to the end?’ Behold, you have spoken, but you have done all the evil that you could.” ... Where has your beloved gone, O most beautiful among women? As far as I last checked, Seth was clearly named. As for my church, as we see it, God commanded polygamy to be practiced in the early days, and then later according to his wisdom He commanded that it no longer be practiced and that is the current state of things today. H I can count the number of people I was with prior to marriage on one hand and my husband had quadruple my experience. They think that they are smart enough to interpret his unspoken intentions. In the original Hebrew, that would disqualify them to lead. God put David in his place, and offered David all of Saul’s possessions. Old one, but goody. God reiterates His promise, saying that Abram will not have to adopt an heir. Years later, Absolom manages to turn the kingdom away from David, becoming king himself. 1 CORINTHIANS 7:1–40Verses in the Bible 2 Samuel 12:8. Jacob goes to live with his uncle, Laban, and there meets Rachel, whom he absolutely falls in love with. God is not going to enable or help or cause a person to sin. I’m not fully comfortable with blaming Sarai with a lack of faith either. conclusion, what it comes down to is ever one has there own calling and what ever we do in word or deed do all to the glory of GOD, whether we eat or drink what ever we do do all to the glory of God, so if you are single glorify, if you get married to one wife glorify God, if you have 1,2,3,4, wives and 20 children glorify God , you work for some one glorify God you own a business Glorify God , you live in a apartment or big mansion Glorify God. When did marriage become something that ordinary people could engage in? He must manage his own household well, with all dignity keeping his children submissive, for if someone does not know how to manage his own household, how will he care for God's church? We don’t know everything that God has going on so we can’t judge his children. So, this account of polygamy certainly can’t be used as justification. but then time past and he was ask again he said martin Luther ( I confess that I cannot forbid a person to marry several wives, for it does not contradict the Scripture. Don’t get me wrong I do tend to go along with your argument of one man to one wife, as even Paul in 1 Timothy 3:2 lays the groundwork to back that up, but the question remains that symbolically Jesus is the Bridegroom(singular) and in the analogy given He fully intends to marry all 10 virgins, but in the end while He doesn’t get all five He does marry the five who had extra oil with them. Thank you! While Gideon served God early in his life, later on, he had started to depart. Didn’t say or assume the Bible did comment on every polygynist family (or even actively disapproved–just not really approved either). Ten years pass and now Sarai, Abram’s wife, becomes impatient with God. For that is your portion in this life and in your work at which you toil under the sun. He felt true sorrow at what he had down. I also agree that all of the polygamous marriages did have a lot of grief. Later on, when reflecting on all the things he has done, the empire he has built, his accomplishments, his life, he says this: Live joyfully with the wife whom you love all the days of your vain life which He has given you under the sun—all the days of futility. And then the story pretty much ends for Gideon. I observe the entire bible(especially the Tanahk & Torah) and must express to you my appreciation of both your studies and your thorough yet concise presentation thereof. Therefore an overseer must be above reproach, the husband of one wife, sober-minded, self-controlled, respectable, hospitable, able to teach, not a drunkard, not violent but gentle, not quarrelsome, not a lover of money. It does say that the King may not hoard all the horses or all the woman as wives. He’s an adulterer and a murderer among other things. So, according to the Book of Mormon (which I don’t hold to, but I’m curious how you defend), God says that having more than one wife is akin to whoredom and an abomination. Only the wealthy were able to do that and monogamy was the norm so I don’t think it significant that many verses in the Bible speak of marriage in monogamous terms. Don't know what to buy? The Hebrew translation of that verse you speak of is understood by the majority to make sense only by meaning the elders should married and not single. I propose that it didn’t. He was angry and hurt. More help. I do believe that both husband and wife have to tend to their sexual relationship and not get lazy. It became a snare to Gideon and to his house. If he takes another wife to himself, he shall not diminish her food, her clothing, or her marital rights. If one wife is not selfish, then neither will 2 or 3 or 4 if motivations are based on love. For example the phrase “into Abraham’s bosom” means to be in the grave….not into his bed. It’s no wonder that I’ve lost the desire to live. If a man had been single, he would have tried to make fantasy a reality. Anyhow, now I study Christianity and Judaism. Most feminists would scream at the top of their lungs if they saw it, but the message is coming from a woman. I would recommend that all Christians take up study in Judaism since Jesus was (at the time) a type of Rabbi. “””Matthew 25 King James Version (KJV) I’m no better than anyone else, I have opinions too. The sages were strictly against inter-caste marriage as it corrupted the blood line and produced sons of lower quality. But David’s life was full of sin. Particularly when you see what happens to the family. Topical Bible Marriage is ordained of God, not some concession to our fallen nature. The Bible compares Christ and the Church to a marriage. Am I crazy or is everyone ignoring the misinformation here about what line Lamech, Noah’s father was from? We won't send you spam. All sacrificing pretty much stopped as well the same time when the temple was destroyed. That doesn’t mean anybody must or even should do it, but it does mean that Abram, Jacob, David etc. I was doing some research into the Torah and one wife versus multiple wives. Consider: So, yeah, I think God said plenty about your desire for more than one wife. And you shall not lie with any animal and so make yourself unclean with it, neither shall any woman give herself to an animal to lie with it: it is perversion. Never says anything against it… People are reading into to much and adding to Gods word…. If you will not listen, if you will not take it to heart to give honor to my name, says the Lord of hosts, then I will send the curse upon you and I will curse your blessings. 9 And I say unto you, Whosoever shall put away his wife, except it be for fornication, and shall marry another, committeth adultery: and whoso marrieth her which is put away doth commit adultery. U theologist, believe u understand God’s word, but are jus as confused. But let me go, that I may hide myself in the field till the third day at evening. If we look at the context of the times, Sarah’s giving Hagar as a wife had nothing to do with anything other than saving personal humiliation at not having children in her tent (look at the examples of Rachel and Leah and see those were nothing more than vindictive sibling rivalries). God knows my heart better than his children. No eye pitied you, to do any of these things to you out of compassion for you, but you were cast out on the open field, for you were abhorred, on the day that you were born. There are so many more and my psych experience has told me that the only thing to do with such people is to go NO CONTACT. Leah counters by offering him another wife: her maid. It makes no sense for God to say don’t multiply your wives instead of kings can only have one wife. “Do not commit NAAPH.” You also have counter examples like the prophet Samuel who’s father had two wives. 2 Samuel 13:32 (KJV) 32 And Jonadab, the son of Shimeah David’s brother, answered and said, Let not my lord suppose [that] they have slain all the young men the king’s sons; for Amnon only is dead: for by the appointment of Absalom this hath been determined from the day that he forced his sister Tamar. Here’s an excerpt of their emails (with their permission): Why is it that the men of the old testament including the heroes of the Christian faith -Abraham, Jacob, Gideon, David, Solomon etc etc all could have multiple wives, concubines, sex slaves of the beautiful captives (Deuteronomy) and with some of these guys they with their wives permission could have sex with others. More help means easier gardening and farming which means less money spent on food bills. People liVing with people does that on its own naturally. Having more than one spouse comes at a cost. Arise, walk in the land through its length and its width, for I give it to you.” Genesis 13:14-17, Then Abram said, “Look, You have given me no offspring; indeed one born in my house is my heir!”, so is my love among the young women. The name of the one was Hannah, and the name of the other, Peninnah. On top of that, there’s the clear laws in Deuteronomy saying kings can’t have more than one wife. So, after Abram had lived ten years in the land of Canaan, Sarai, Abram's wife, took Hagar the Egyptian, her servant, and gave her to Abram her husband as a wife. Looking for a Christmas gift for your spouse that shows you make intimacy a priority? After all, He had made a covenant, and unconditional promise, with Abram, to protect His descendants. “When did God stop allowing multiple wives”, What do wives want? Aside from the biblical declarations that they are sin, polyamorous relationships cannot fulfill what the Bible says a marriage is to be. He rejected God’s counsel of having one wife and got many, and it ended in disaster. Seems a simpler explanation than your conspiracy theory. I can tell you from a woman’s perspective, it is highly provoking to sin (anger, bitterness, envy, rage) and I have been destroyed in ways I have never thought possible. God’s people continued to Obey him for 20 generations until Abram. I give my heart and body to them because I love them. I’ve adjusted the post. I thought they were his friends that were to accompany him into the banquet (a custom at the time, as I understand). A married couple cannot fully love one another if that love is divided among other people. But most western church goers do not know Torah well, so this goes without notice. Therefore an overseer must be above reproach, the husband of one wife, sober-minded, self-controlled, respectable, hospitable, able to teach. 1. Another example of this family’s difficulty in waiting for God to fulfill His promises. Not 401ks and worldly social programs). While remarriage is not sinful in some cases, I know first hand that even where remarriage is morally acceptable, there is always baggage that goes with having had another spouse. It allowed “polygyny” i.e., one husband-multiple wives. No kids from prior marriages or experiences. Arise, walk in the land through its length and its width, for I give it to you.” Genesis 13:14-17. Do you have a scripture that shows them to be brides? In … Even for those who don’t believe polygamy is sinful, it is selfish and is similar to someone who spends all their time playing computer games or at the gym or on other hobbies. So, when did it change? Tell me, how is this a “blessing?”. You have to be trying hard to ignore it. It is no better or worse than Multiple Wives. Our son said to our youngest son, “You are like my brother from another mother,” and he laughed. I think this makes the argument a little stronger, but if we jump back to Genesis 1, after the man and his wife are created, we see this: Then God saw everything that He had made, and indeed it was very good. ... To the married I give this charge (not I, but the Lord): the wife should not separate from her husband (but if she does, she should remain unmarried or else be reconciled to her husband), and the husband should not divorce his wife. But for Adam there was not found a helper fit for him. But if they do not have self-control, let them marry; for it is better to marry than to burn with passion” (1 Corinthians 7:8-9). I am the Lord. I need fact not opinion. Much evil happened after that but as a result of the adultery and murder, not the polygamy. ““into Abraham’s bosom” means to be in the grave.” Argumentative. ... “You shall not covet your neighbor's house; you shall not covet your neighbor's wife, or his male servant, or his female servant, or his ox, or his donkey, or anything that is your neighbor's.”. Just because someone isn’t directly sinful, it can be sinful in that it is about chasing pleasure instead of chasing God. But, Laban swaps Rachel for Leah, his eldest daughter, on the wedding day and Jacob doesn’t notice until morning. I had not noticed that one before. When Rome was rewriting the “New Testament” into Greek (yes Greek is a translation too.) They were faithful by accounts. And his wives turned away his heart. There were a few people who have very strong feelings on people who have married multiple times. Apparently, David was not sinless (excepting the one transgression). In Jacob’s time it was forbidden, but there were some back then who pointed to David and Solomon to justify their doing it anyway. Therefore a man shall leave his father and his mother and hold fast to his wife, and they shall become one flesh. Piercings to the hilt. Just as we won’t take the parable of the thief in the night and say that it’s okay for us all to become thieves, because Jesus is our model, and he’s a thief in the parable. The new blog is just to explore those areas of theology that don’t directly interact with marriage or sexuality. Monogamy comes at a cost too, but I do agree that making a polygamous arrangement work is a lot harder than a monogamous marriage. No, likewise with that situation. This being the breaking of Gods words when he warned us not to speak for him but to simply teach what he had given us without altering his words. You could argue that expresses the Trinity. “None of you shall approach any one of his close relatives to uncover nakedness. I was thinking of this exact question today in my studies! Just ours and just together. But I am just as far from convinced that you possess the truth. They try to easily explain it away with “oh, that was the Old Testament”, as if the Old Testament doesn’t matter. First of all a lot of older languages never had differences in words for plural or singular. Having more than one marriage doesn’t change that as each marriage David had was between him and one woman. He started worshiping this idol he had put up, and fell away. I feel that people try to put themselves above God. We ourselves are the children of God, thus we have no power over our brothers and sisters. 6 And at midnight there was a cry made, Behold, the bridegroom cometh; go ye out to meet him. There is no different spiritual outcome for either choice. That’s why Joseph was told by God in a dream, “DO not be afraid to take Mary ad thy wife…..” if his mother was to be just a young girl Jesus purpose would have always been questioned, even today. (De Wette II, 459, ibid., pp. . It doesn’t say she had given up on the Lord’s promise and was doing this ‘instead of’ rather than ‘in addition to’ so you can’t rule either out. The man may be married to more than one woman, but those marriages are separate events. The law of Moses did not forbid it, in fact it regulated it laying out rules on how husbands with plural wives should conduct themselves. After things have settled, Israel lives in peace for 40 years (during which they unfortunately start to depart from God again), and Gideon starts collecting wives. Now concerning the matters about which you wrote: “It is good for a man not to have sexual relations with a woman.”. I decided to answer this one in a post also because I think Christianity tends to gloss over details like this. ‣ But, now that he is married, the thoughts don’t go away and it’s easier to cross a line into reality. In essence, he says no we don’t stay married to those we married on earth. It is also questionable to me to claim that polygamy is a violation of marriage being one man and one woman. This is the case for me and my (female) best friend, at least. If the Kings didn't have any son there would be no one to rule the Kingdom. From toys to furniture, Married Dance has it all, in a friendly Christian environment. That excess was wrong. The idea that God gave David multiple wives and would have given more is, I believe, flawed. I see nowhere in the Bible that God didn’t communicate his intentions. I really appreciate this! I received a question this week in my inbox. 'For this reason a man shall leave his father and mother and be joined to his wife, 'and the two shall become one flesh'; so then they are no longer two, but one flesh. Please, go in to my maid; perhaps I shall obtain children by her.” And Abram heeded the voice of Sarai. Our current concept of marriage as a “romantic” arrangement founded on love and respect is VERY recent and has very little in common with marriage in the Bible. Enoch was the only other righteous man and he was taken up by God (my speculation was to not have to suffer the wrath of the flood). Thank you indeed for this conversation, I’ve enjoyed it. It’s hard to see past what you have been indoctrinated in to. Jacob has just run away from home having tricked his brother into giving away his birthright, and tricked his father into bestowing it on him. God sent him to Earth to represent himself but relate to is in human flesh. Our “interpretations” of what God really meant when He didn’t condemn polygyny (when He clearly condemns a multitude of other specific moral and sexual acts) should be rather simple: He didn’t condemn or prohibit it. He came to him and said to him, “There were two men in a certain city, the one rich and the other poor. We haven’t been intimate in ten years. That was one heck of indiscretion. But the bible also clearly displays that there will indeed be marriage in heaven. He was misquoted as he was quoting Torah. Can it be that there is no one among you wise enough to settle a dispute between the brothers, ... Paul, a servant of Christ Jesus, called to be an apostle, set apart for the gospel of God, which he promised beforehand through his prophets in the holy Scriptures, concerning his Son, who was descended from David according to the flesh and was declared to be the Son of God in power according to the Spirit of holiness by his resurrection from the dead, Jesus Christ our Lord, through whom we have received grace and apostleship to bring about the obedience of faith for the sake of his name among all the nations, ... ‘Therefore a man shall leave his father and mother and hold fast to his wife. I can’t do that. Multiple Wives are very successful if done correctly. Your desire to live should come from your relationship with God, not your relationship with your spouse, and the impetus should be “what I can do for Him”, not “what can I get out of life”. The wives are not married to each other. 25 Then shall the kingdom of heaven be likened unto ten virgins, which took their lamps, and went forth to meet the bridegroom. Here, you can check – I’ll give you a few minutes. I’m being open and honest with you so please do the same for me. I would put forth that it was to create a relationship that cannot be duplicated in poly-amorous relationships. That’s the clearest I’ve seen Butterfly Wings. The male equivalent is “heis”, which is translated as “one” 229 times in the KJV. That implicitly means sex, and is what made David’s sin more apt to Nathan’s rebuke about the 1 little lamb, when David had so many others. But this verse doesn’t say God would give him more wives. All of God’s instructions regarding multiple wives start with a conditional “if”, much like the commands about divorce. It is a blessing and grace given to them during that time. And you do not have to try very hard to continually find such counterpoints (like Ecclesiastes – a time of love a time of hate, a time of war a time of peace. OpenBible.info R Clearly not a commandment by God, and I’d argue never God’s intent. I’m sure you know the difference between adding and multiplying. I personally felt a spiritual ripping away from my husband when this happened and am trying to fight against feeling spiritually dead. Most translations actually say bosom, but they pretty much all imply given as true “wives”, and that means “relations” just by Jewish Law alone. Now, I could point out that God says “I will make him a helper…”, a helper, not helpers. And yes, I do think that is the only acceptable marriage. It’s a clear defiance and contrary to God’s will. God has one wife: His people (as a whole). So, Rachel offers him another wife: her maid. When Rachel saw that she bore Jacob no children, she envied her sister. The man gave names to all livestock and to the birds of the heavens and to every beast of the field. Y Due to patriarchal societies, it was nearly impossible for an unmarried woman to provide for herself. My aunt pitched a fit and a week later the jewelry ‘miraculously’ reappeared. Thank you for the discussion. My wife has ancestors from the early days of our church who were polygamous and she knows their stories. Church policy reflects the fact that at this time God has commanded it not be practiced. Stop trying to put words in God’s mouth and show me the verse that condemns it. Western marriage is based on feelings and this socially define idea of “love” one can fall in and out of. The Bible does not forbid elders nor kings to have more than one wife. Thus, it’s a form of “death on the installment plant”: a mockery of what it should be. Absalom killed Amnon only not all of King David sons. Apparently God didn’t see a need for a second or third wife. The reason for it was pretty smart. Best explanation I’ve ever heard. “If I don’t love my spouse any longer, I should get a divorce.” It’s a tragedy to lose love in marriage. In the original Hebrew, that would disqualify them to lead. There is only your spouse. Anthropologists and other historians agree that “marriage” wasn’t even available for the common people in ancient times. He instructed the bishops of churches to have only one wife. The fundamental principal of the old law was two things – 1, you have to be Jewish and 2, you had to sacrifice. And what is my sin before your father, that he seeks my life?” And he said to him, “Far from it! In short, the Bible doesn’t offer a solution that I’m aware of, and I’m really not sure what I’d counsel to someone put in that position. That doesn’t mean God is condoning his neighbour sleeping with his wives, but rather that there would be chaos and unlawfulness. I wrote an article a while back about what I learned from being married three times. Wow, now that’s a question that doesn’t get asked often in western countries. Ezekiel 23. God made Adam. 2 Samuel 12:8 does say God gave David many wives, but that could just be as well be interpreted as “into your keeping” instead of “into your bed”. It helps me deepen my understanding in Christianity in a way I never thought possible. While I don’t think God ever wanted people to have multiple wives, there are instances in the Bible where it happened, and people made the best of it. So God created man in his own image, in the image of God he created him; male and female he created them. Don’t mean He’s in favor of it. As such, David was a prefigure or foreshadow of Christ. I deserve better. I’m defining it by the underlying principle, of being monogamous so long as you both live. O One and one. 1 Kings 11:3 (KJV) 3 And he had seven hundred wives, princesses, and three hundred concubines: and his wives turned away his heart. I answered the ones I could and deferred this one for a post, because I felt it was fairly involved and I hadn’t yet tackled it on the blog in any great depth. Paul also says not to get divorced (1 Corinthians 7:10-11). All those conflicts result from our fallen nature which leads us to be selfish or unkind. 1 Corinthians 7:2. I think a good question for those who believe that multiple wives is still a valid religious marital structure is to ask, what about the religious right of a wife to have multiple husbands? As we speculate about God’s silence, there is at least one key factor to consider. 1Tim 3:2 lays out a requirement for somebody becoming a Bishop that they be the husband of ‘one wife’, which can be seen as implying there were faithful early Christians with plural wives, as was allowed among the Jews back then. But the Bible is not thereby endorsing polygamy, but indeed … Indeed, I have already cursed them, because you do not lay it to heart. We now know that works will not save us, that the law is there to teach us that we need Christ. Don’t worry, that’s not going anywhere. a group marriage.. Keep up the good work! We see God noticing that creation is not yet complete. Then the Bible falls into cohesion. Then the Lord God said, “It is not good that the man should be alone; I will make him a helper fit for him.”. Please stop telling the other children that they are doing wrong when father didn’t say it. Genesis 1:27 and 2:24, Exodus 20:18, Mathew 19:3-6 As well, there’s Genesis 2 where God spells out that 2 become one. Thanks for reading. If you have multiple spouses, how can you possibly find time to dedicate to God’s ministry? But why would you assume he approved of it? I come from an interesting family because my mom’s side is ethnically Jewish. Half of her head shaved. 9 But the wise answered, saying, Not so; lest there be not enough for us and you: but go ye rather to them that sell, and buy for yourselves. “If a man has two wives, the one loved and the other unloved, and both the loved and the unloved have borne him children, and if the firstborn son belongs to the unloved, then on the day when he assigns his possessions as an inheritance to his sons, he may not treat the son of the loved as the firstborn in preference to the son of the unloved, who is the firstborn, but he shall acknowledge the firstborn, the son of the unloved, by giving him a double portion of all that he has, for he is the firstfruits of his strength. ‣ Who married? Or he had no control over what happened you post a long blog about when God decided man should not have multiple wives but u never really answered the question. He rules 3 years before his former supporters turn on him. “One of many powers” if you want to get technical. Anyway, with a little more thought on the topic, the explicit directive is actually there – in all the verses that say if someone marries another while their first spouse is alive, they are committing adultery. Nothing in this story leads me to believe that polygamy is a good thing or that God wanted it this way. His family doesn’t come off at all as dysfunctional. – Judges 8:30-31. The whole process could take up to a year hence the need to be ever presently ready for when the bridegroom came, which as we all know five of the women weren’t. if david and all those can do it and still go to heaven we all can. We like to use our feeble minds(in comparison to the father and the son) to make sense of what we don’t understand. If you can, please post. I don’t spend much time with them either. (For the Pharisees and all the Jews do not eat unless they wash their hands, holding to the tradition of the elders, and when they come from the marketplace, they do not eat unless they wash. And there are many other traditions that they observe, such as the washing of cups and pots and copper vessels and dining couches.) So, he goes to his mother’s family to raise enough money to hire people to kill all 70 of his brothers, and he becomes king. You shall not let your cattle breed with a different kind. It’s in the context of all his possessions, prestige and power. We are an educated family and both of us will have terminal degrees after I finish a PhD in Clinical Psychology. martin Luther was ask about this about one having another wife , his first response was very negative in no way could this be ! C now one who is married to one wife or husband may judge him or her who are married to 4 wives but they are happy and fulfilled you just worry about if your Glorifying God in your life, because every one is always going to have an opinion. Be wary of Satan spirit for it will tell you that good is evil and evil is good. Given this instance in scripture I find it a little hard to put the final nail in the coffin that its a sin to have more than one wife, but as you showed with a breakdown of scripture it certainly seems to be the smart thing to have but one wife. I do believe that a good sexual relationship HELPS a marriage and that no sexual relationship DESTROYS a marriage. A married couple cannot be “one flesh” ( Genesis 2:24) if multiple “fleshes” are involved. Women have other women to talk with and hold them accoutable. –  Ecclesiastes 9:9. So, if David sinned in this way (in addition to Bathsheba and Uriah), how many others are unaccounted for? Not fair to 2 health women either or to any healthy man.
2020 what does the bible say about multiple marriages